Danielle Ellis:

Dear Suzy,

Welcome to the UKRC blog, your journey is incredible. Could you tell me how you have managed to juggle work and home life?, continuing to work full time and now having five children.

thanks Danielle

Suzy Walton :

Hi Danielle,

I often ask myself the same question! It is not easy juggling work and children - particularly in my case as I have a young baby as well as four other children. The key for me is organisation. I spend a good few hours each week planning ahead - the next week in great detail and subsequent weeks in outline. I don't have any relatives close by so I am dependent upon paid professional help. Networks are also key - I will often ask my friends for suggestions about conflicting demands on my time and they frequently come up with solutions I hadn't though about.

Also, I am not afraid to remind the organisations I work for that I'm not super human. I find people are more understanding than you might imagine. The important thing is not to allow home responsibilities to stop you fulfilling your potential at work - if you are dedicated and skilled then people will see that and (usually) understand that occasionally the juggling gets a little too hard!

Ruth Wilson (moderator):

Hi Suzy,

Thank you for joining us on the blog. Its very inspiring that you have opted to study science a bit later than it usual, and have made such a success of your career. I have checked out the Institute of Director's site https://www.iod.com/Home/Training-and-Development/ , and they offer a range of training - all of it sounds fascinating and of enormous use to people at boardroom level.

But it costs - membership of IoD starts at £500, and the courses themselves are far from cheap. In addition, you have to be operating at a senior level in organisations with formally constituted boards. We work to help women reach and do well at these levels, but are you aware of other routes to the top, for women who may not be able to meet the fees or all the entry criteria?

I am really looking forward to meeting you at our conference - blog readers are strongly encouraged to book now! http://www.theukrc.org/news-and-events/ukrc-annual-conference

Templeton Peck:

Hi Suzy,

A truly amazing story! And, what an inspiration!

If you've received one great piece of advice from someone who's inspired you, what would it be?

Hold on to that passion - it's quite infectious...

TP

Karen Webb:

Wow thats amazing, I admire your determination and drive for success, do you have any ambitions yet to fulfil?

KW

David Winterburn:

Hi Suzy, Very inspiring story! I have been altruistic for many years at one stage holding 13 roles simultaneously on various Boards.I now have significant experience and would like to know how I can make the transition from voluntary to paid Non-Executive Directorships. In essence,How did you become qualified to sit on Boards,was there one thing that provided a launchpad for your own career? David Winterburn, Harrison Winterburn Executive Search and Past Chairman of the Recruitment &Employment Confederation

Freda Palm:

I am truly amazed and inspired by your achievements. I myself aspire to make a difference to my world, particularly in infrastructure development for bringing reliable power supply and transmission to developing nations. This is my vision, I am not doing that right now, but I am hopeful that the experience I am getting now in utilities will in some way contribute later, and will also open up opportunities.

You have 5 kids, have lost a husband along the way and are still going. That could not have been easy. Have you ever had difficult times in your career? When you had children, did you have a career break and was your return to work ever welcomed with reduced career prospects? I ask because I did not have a particularly great welcome back to work, despite having no issues with childcare as my mom was very happy to look after my child. This shook me up, but I am only more determined to improve my qualifications and career prospects.

Suzy Walton :

Great to hear from so many of you (and hope to see some of you at the conference), Let me take the questions in turn:

RUTH WILSON
I mentioned the Institute of Directors training courses and you mentioned that membership of the IoD is £500 (I'm quoting you, I'm not sure what current rates are) and courses are not cheap. Indeed! However you don't have to join to do the courses you can just do a one off course if you can identify the one that would be most useful. Also they have some very interesting networking / lecture type events - I go to a lot of them (they are cheaper) and find the contacts I make in the social part of the event just as useful as the formal bit. There are other ways to get the sort of training you need for boards however - once you get your public appointment at board level (and it is not as difficult as you might think) you can ask for sponsorship for training. The point is once you get your first board appointment you can't be expected to have the full set of boardroom skills (finance, strategy, risk management, HR, marketing, crisis management, change management to name a few) - so you can ask for sponsorship for some training.

It is not as hard as one might think to get that first role (back to your 'are there other routes to the top) question. There are huge numbers of public appointments at board level (and you can view them by putting 'public appointments' into a search engine). So long as you are prepared to be flexible on what that first role is - it could be local, regional, or national and it could be in any sector not necessarily the one you have functional expertise in - once you have that first role it becomes a springboard for subsequent roles.

TEMPLETON PECK
Good question about what advice I've had from someone who inspired me. I think that would be Geoff Mulgan who I worked with in government (he was the Prime Minister's Head of Strategy and is now the Director of The Young Foundation) - he always told me to have a strong narrative. In other words, whatever you are doing - giving a talk, having a job interview etc you need a strong message and you need to put it across well. I think Americans refer to this as the 'elevator pitch'. I repeat this to myself frequently, especially when I'm trying to put a complex policy into layman's terms.

KAREN WEBB
You ask what ambition I have yet to fulfill - I would like to feel I could make the route easier for others to succeed - particularly those in under represented groups and short of becoming a minister I'm always looking for opportunities to do this!

DAVID WINTERBURN
You once had 13 board roles! I salute you! You ask about making the transition from voluntary to paid non-exec roles. As you will know very few Charities remunerate trustees/non-execs. This isn't because they don't wish to but because they are limited by the Charities Commission. One way to make the transition - in my view - is to try to get an NHS non-exec role. There are, as you probably know, many types of NHS roles, from board positions on regular hospitals - which are largely still under Whitehall control, to board positions on a Foundation Trust ( FT). FTs are more independent of Whitehall and they usually pay more to non-execs, however they don't necessarily require a different skill set.

Also, it's worth keeping your eyes on public appointments generally (see above) as there are some very interesting and diverse committees which often pay a daily rate. Usually a specific skill set is required but the range of public bodies is so great that you will eventually see one that maps well onto your experience.

You also ask about being qualified to sit on boards. For me it was partly getting the Chartered Director qualification and having a background in Whitehall but so many different skill sets fit one for boards. It is really a case of being very strategic on what one's past roles and education mean in terms of hard skills and then developing the ability to put this across during the application process. Boards appoint from a range of backgrounds and - in my opinion - almost everyone that has served a community in some way has the skill set that could get them a board position.

FREDA PALM
I admire your vision - stick with it and you will get there one step at a time. You ask very good questions about whether I found it difficult returning to work with children. I have never taken career breaks. The political line of course would be that any women should take the full amount of maternity leave they are entitled to. I do support this, but I recognise the harsh reality that sometimes women do come back to find their job has been changed. I have always therefore opted for a sort of half way house. I set myself a date when I will be fully back in all my roles, but if I am well enough I will always try to give some odd days to organisations before I'm really expected back. This is to demonstrate to them that my commitment is still high. I then ask for a bit of flexibility in return if/when I should need it. To be blunt, I have experienced some problems but usually it's because people simply don't know what to expect from a women with children (especially lots of children), so I will sit down with them and explain that I am the same person with the same skill set, it's just that sometimes I may be more tired than others and may need to duck out one or two things. I also explain to people what strategies I have for organising myself. It seems that usually (though not always) people simple need reassuring.

Freda Palm:

Suzy, that is fantastic advice, very wise indeed. I will take that onboard. All I have left to say to you about your achievements and ambition is YOU GO GIRL!!!!!!!!!!!

Suzy Walton :

Freda, I've re read your original post. It is truly lovely to see such ambition - particularly when you say you are not directly working towards that now but you will be in the future. If you have a clear goal that is half the battle. There's one other thing that occurred to me - if people have undermined you in the past in relation to your ability to manage the juggling, don't allow that to erode your self-esteem. I call it the 'no' network - if you are still surrounded by a 'no' network, make sure you keep them update with all your progress and achievements and they can then draw their own conclusions about whether women are held back if they are mothers!

Ian Watmore:

Great story - an inspiration to many I am sure

Ruth Wilson (moderator):

Hi Suzy,

There's so much encouragement here - thank you!

The 'no network' is an interesting concept. Could you expalin a bit more? Do you only apply it to attitudes around women at work/work life balance, or does it work in other ways as well?

Louise Raw:

Hi Suzy,
I'm delighted that you say your ambition is to help other women fulfil their potential as you have done. It's always disappointing when otherwise inspiring women 'pull the ladder up after them' and decide that as they've succeeded, everyone else can and must do the same, and don't acknowledge the problems of the 'glass ceiling' and sexism (in the workplace as well as wider society).
I'm interested to know if you would define yourself as a feminist? And have you encountered much sexism, direct or indirect- if so, how do you deal with it?
Lastly, I know it's annoying when only successful women, never men,get asked how their kids feel about having such a busy Mum (with the implication that they should really be home more!)- but as a mother myself I wonder if you've got good tips on how to make children feel part of your achievements, and that they do come first, when you have a lot of competiting demands on your time?
Thanks Suzy and more power to your elbow

Suzy Walton :

There have been some fascinating comments this weekend!

Ian Watmore -
Thank you for dropping by. I see you are the new Chief Operating Officer in the Cabinet Office and I know you used to be government's diversity champion - perhaps you could drum up some support for the Women Mean Business conference in central London on 12 October.

Ruth Wilson -
You asked about the 'no' network - I believe the majority of women have a 'no' network around them at home, or at work or both. These are the people that are all too quick to tell women not to apply for the job, seek that promotion, diversify etc. People believe they are offering counsel based around your own best interests - in my personal experience however men would appear to have 'yes' networks around them! My personal response to this is to weigh up all work opportunities myself and then ask a small but trusted group of friends and colleagues what they believe the risks would be if I were to take the role - in other words I seek their views on how I might best manage that particular opportunity rather than whether I should go for it or not.

Louise Raw -
Would I describe myself as a feminist? Yes and no! I prefer to see myself as a public interest advocate. I try to promote what is in the best interests of society as a whole rather than one specific group on the grounds that there is usually more than one sub group that might be adversely affected by a particular policy or ideology.

For example, I'm on the Ethics Group of the National DNA Database - and I have particular responsibility for protecting and advocating children's rights in the DNA process. I'm also on the National Specialist Commissioning Group which oversees the purchase of healthcare for all rare and specialist conditions. I am the only lay member of the group and try to promote the interests and rights of patients in the widest sense.

So, my interest is in promoting greater equality in society particularly in public services. That's not to say I don't stand on my soap box sometimes and bang the drum for women - for example when I've been pregnant and get the inevitable question - "how on earth will you cope?" - I pretend I simply don't understand the question, ask for clarification and watch them tie themselves in knots!

You also ask specifically if I've encountered sexism? Yes! However since I'm psychologist I choose to believe (though I could be wrong on this) that a lot of sexism is not deliberate but simply ignorance (for example the comment above about whether a woman can cope with children and work). If we believe therefore that much sexism is due to lack of knowledge then we should challenge it. Not occasionally - but every time we encounter it. This is something we can all do - though in my personal experience this strategy only really works if you are able to challenge with a bit of humour - people respond better to a challenge than a direct criticism.

Suzy Walton :

Louise Raw -
You also asked how to make children feel part of one's achievements and that they do come first when you have competing demands on your time. Breaking this down into two parts - firstly I always share my achievements with the children and ask them about their own achievements that day/week so that they feel we are all working together as a family in what we do (I also share disappointments with them though so that they don't believe the bar is set too high).

And in terms of how to reassure them that they come first when I have competing demands on my time, it might sound a bit algorithmic but what works for me is 'protected time' - ie they know that weekdays are when I must focus on work but weekends and evenings are largely times when they absolutely come first. But to be a tad provocative - although my children come first, there are times when sometimes work has to come first. Employers need me (and have rights over my time) as well as the children. This was particularly the case when I was in the Cabinet Office, but when I do have to put work first I will always seek to take back some time and give that to the family when the crisis has passed.

Hector:

Suzy,

Fascinating story, and thank you for sharing it with us. You mention that you were an actress before moving into other areas. Are there skills you learnt while on stage that you feel have helped you in your later career?

Suzy Walton :

Hector
You ask about whether any skills from my acting days have proved helpful in my subsequent career. Yes actually. One of the biggest fears most people have is public speaking. I've seen people prepare and even over prepare talks with excellent content and yet they fail in the delivery. What acting taught me was to hold you head high, say it, and say it with confidence. When you face very large audiences - as I did in the West End - then you learn to portray confidence even if you don't feel you have it.

I also learnt a useful tip in government - if you're giving a talk and for just a moment you completely forget your next point, just stop. Stop thinking and do/say nothing. Very quickly you will remember where you are and the audience will be convinced that was a dramatic pause for effect!

Christine Harper:

Hi Suzy

Your story is really inspiring and I was wondering what advice you could give me in pursuing a career in science.

Suzy Walton:

Christine Harper

Research your options, narrow down to a few possibilities and then make sure you take advice from as many sources as possible. Without knowing which stage of education you are at, it's hard to give more specific advice. The only thing I would say is that of course there are many subjects (ie psychology) that are science subjects but the general perception is that they are not. So, you must be careful re your actual choice of subject to study. And you are likely - depending on your ultimate choice of career - to need a masters degree also. Key is the initial research - make sure you make informed decisions. Good luck! ne

Ruth Wilson (moderator):

Hi Suzy and everyone - fascinating questions, and great responses! Christine, we are here to help women get into careers in science. Give us a call.

Grace Ko:

Hi Suzy,
Your journey and career path is indeed inspirational!
I am a recently divorced mother of two girls whom are now in secondary school. At aged 41, I feel ready to return to the world of work but after having had such a long career break, am somewhat apprehensive. My degree is in Life Sciences and before having my children, I worked for environmental health.
I was wondering what advice you could give me in terms of any support/business groups that might be able to help me. I am a firm believer in networking with a view to finding the right role. Do you think my age is against me and how could I embelish my CV to make it more attractive to prospective employers?
My sincere thanks for your help and advice.
Grace.

Suzy Walton :

Grace Ko
Thank you for posting! It's illegal to discriminate on the grounds of age, so when you do a CV or apply for things you are perfectly at liberty to leave age off. However, personally, I would sell your age. You are not too old to return to the world of work - at 41 you have a career of over twenty years ahead of you! Your age brings with it wisdom and experience so I would mention age.

On your specific question regarding any support/business groups that might be able to help, I think this is something that Ruth the moderator could help with. Ruth - could you let Grace know how to contact you?

Finally in terms of your CV - you have had a career break and during that time you have raised two children. This must never appear as a sort of apology on a CV but rather frame this time carefully - while looking after the children did you do any voluntary work? If so, what were the skills you learnt or demonstrated by doing that?. State that on the CV in terms of the type of activity and what your responsibilities were. If you didn't do any regular voluntary work, did you do any one off events? If you would like to email me care of my website - www.suzywalton.com I would be happy to share my CV with you. In terms of presentation - I always mention on my CV that I have children (though I have to say that I have so many that sometimes people ask me if it's a typo!)

Suzy Walton :

I thought I would develop further the notion I introduced earlier of the 'no' network - the group of people we have surrounding us that will always find reasons as to why we shouldn't go for that next job / special assignment etc.

Tonight I was at a talk given by mountaineer Amy Beeton one of the few British women to have reached the summit of Mount Everest. She too speaks of the 'no' network. Time and time again she has come up against people who have told her not to climb / not to risk her health / to slow down or settle down or both. She even did one major expedition just days after surgery. At this particular time she was told by many people to cancel the forthcoming expedition. What did she do.....took her own counsel and made the climb!

She says she feels that when making important decisions it's very important to have some time alone to be certain of what it is YOU want to do and then to have the courage to see this through and not to let the dissenters influence you. Great advice (and she's a very inspirational speaker).

Jessica Learmond-Criqui:

Can you explain a bit what it was like studying for the IOD Chartered Director exams? How much work was involved and would you recommend this course to others who worked full time?

Suzy Walton :

Jessica Learmond-Criqui -
You ask specifically about the Chartered Director qualification. This is a boardroom level qualification awarded by the Institute of Directors. I can honestly say that of all my qualifications this had made the most difference to how I perform in the boardroom.

Chartered Director - just to clarify - is a qualification offered to experienced board members who wish to ensure they have reached particular standards in the whole range of duties a board carries out. The first part of the qualification is the Certificate in Company Director. For this you study about 6 different modules on topics such as finances, HR, change management and marketing (there are others). You then take exams in each area and have to reach a pass standard in every exam. You then go forward to the Diploma in Company Direction where you are required - in examination - to demonstrate the application of the knowledge gained at the earlier stages and from your actual experiences at board. Then finally you compile your personal experiences at board into a portfolio of evidence and you are assessed against standard board competences by two experienced directors.

This is not a qualification to be taken lightly, as it demands real commitment. However by its very nature you would expect it to be difficult to achieve as someone with the C Dir qualification is expected to be capable of operating in many different areas at board level. We want standards on boards to be high! In fact in the recently revised Combined Code on Corporate Governance (Financial Reporting Council) the case is made for the importance of training for the boardroom.

It is the right qualification for some people but it is not right for everyone. It took me approximately 18 months to complete. I would say it takes most people slightly longer, but I decided to focus as I very much wanted the qualification due to my enlarging portfolio of board roles.

You ask specifically if I would recommend the course to people who work full time. Yes, I would. The IoD organise the training on a modular basis so you can fit the courses around work. They back up the formal training with very useful on-line resources.

I have a lot of professional qualifications and I can honestly say that Chartered Director is the one that best allows me to fulfill my duties as a board member. That's not to say that every single part of the training was enjoyable - but it is certainly immensely useful!

Templeton Peck:

It's nice to see that you've attracted some very fascinating contributions to match your articulate, considered and very informative responses.

Which female scientist do you most admire? And, why? What was her contribution to the advancement of scientific knowledge?

Good stuff!

TP

Suzy Walton :

Templeton Peck -
An interesting question because as you'll know sadly there are not that many prominent female scientists.

The female scientist I think I most admire is Baroness Susan Greenfield. Not only has she made an outstanding contribution to our understanding of the physiology of the brain and done so much to further our understanding of Parkinson's and Alzheimer's but she is also able to fight her corner. Sadly she has, in my opinion, come up against some grossly unfair public criticism and I admire how she deals with this.

Amanda Feggetter:

Hello Suzy
What are you views on the value of doing psychology as a science degree rather than and arts ? and how valuable do you feel the scientific approach is to what you do now?

Suzy Walton :

Amanda Feggetter -

I think doing psychology as a BSc rather than a BA is a wise option - it keeps open many doors. Psychology IS a science and therefore should be studied as such in my view. The exception might be perhaps if one is intending to use psychology perhaps in order to go into counselling as a profession.

I feel the scientific approach is very valuable to what I do now. I sit on boards with a range of people all from different backgrounds. We are so different in our approaches and views that if people can put across an evidenced based view it does allow for some objective assessment. There is a place for expert opinion but it is useful to hear the evidence based opinions first and then use expert judgement to reach a final decision.

I'm not saying that people without a scientific background can't put forward an evidenced based approach, but training in scientific methodology certain helps. It also helps when questioning functional experts at board level who are fully integrated on a daily basis in the subject matter and so need a useful objective challenge.

Thank you for your questions.

N P Singh:

Dear Suzy Walton
Merry Christmas and warm greetings for a happy new year. It has been quite exciting to read ur professional journey. No doubt it has been quite stimulating and inspiring. As a scientist ( Psychologist) at DRDO, DOD, Govt. of India I was going through the literature on Combat Stress and by chance happened to see Combat stress society with which u are presently associated as an Hon'ble trustee. I am absolutely inspired by you society and its aims. It is great to know how the society is rendering a humanistic service to those who have tried to save the honor of their country.
Well since u are actively associate with this area. I am tasked by my orgn to conduct an international conference on Advances in Military Psychology: Soldier Preparedness,from 10th to 12 March 2011. at our office in India.As org sec of the conference I fell honored in extending you a warm invitation for a keynote speaker during this conference. I strongly feel your presence and participation in this conference will be of great inspiration for the Psy fraternity, as the conf. is being attended by Psychologists all over the globe. A group of officials from MOD, UK recently visited our institute along with Sec of Def. UK. with whom we shared the contents of our conf.They assured that some officials/professionals from UK may attend.However on reading ur profile and competence in this area i feel, it will be an honor to have ur participation in this conference.Details of the conference can be seen at www.icamp2011.org. On hearing from u I can start the process for ur travel and hospitality.
May i humbly request u to consider this invitation in the spirits of ur society and oblige with a positive reply.
With Warm regards : N P Singh, Scientist, DIPR, DRDO, MOD, India.

N P singh:

Hi Suzy walton
There has been no reply to my above request. It seems i forgot to mention my email id. It is npssalyal@yahoo.co.in
With regards N P singh

Ruth Wilson (moderator):

Thanks for your inquiry. I have forwarded your request on to Suzy who may contact you direct or here on the blog.